The reconcilation bill has taken a beating at the hands of Joe Manchin and Kyrsten Sinema. If they manage to completely gut and meaningful reform from the bill and Biden touts it as a great victory, should progressives primary Biden in 2024?
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Caller: So what's going on with the infrastructure bill and I really want yeah and hey I get that something is better than nothing. I do agree with that and so at some point we're gonna have to take it because we're gonna have to take it. But what I really hope is that progressives don't walk away or let the establishment walk away thinking that they've had a victory and that they're gonna be able to sell this thing. I think the effort's done we need to take what we can get. but then we need to punish the establishment as much as possible. and let them know that no this was not acceptable. and you're not going to be able to campaign on this. because you don't, you don't negotiate with corruption is my thought. I was kind of wondering what your thoughts are.
Emma: Well, I don't know how you punish it. I mean honestly to me if there is, I mean Bernie's already kind of planning his flag at this moment about the medicare expansion. He's essentially saying it's not coming out. if manchin really thinks he's gonna like to try to big ball it for lack of a better word and really not allow for the expansion of medicare benefits for dental vision and hearing. then I think progressive sink the bill. I think you sink the bill. Caller: yeah well i i i hope so i was kind of that's what i was wondering what your line was i personally think we should think it now but i know that maybe i'm being a little bit too hardcore about it. but then the answer is then if we don't think it now even if we get these minimal you know medicare stuff which is it's not nothing. it's not nothing. but when they're negotiating from a place of dishonesty at what point does it go from being about the bill to about the American values and how we're going to make bills. And at what point do we accept a defeat here for future victories?
Matt: Well I mean I think it's difficult because we're acting as if sort of voters and sort of pundits are the same as electoral people or elected officials. which I mean like I don't think yeah i think you're right that whatever happens it's not adequate and I think that's the message of the left. I think anybody on the left should not sort of get out the vote by trying to put lipstick on this pig. like and it needs to be framed as a portrayal of the media. how like the squad does i would hope that it is along those lines and otherwise i think that would be a sign of intense weakness. and I would expect the rest of the democrats to run on it as if it's the best thing since sliced bread.
Caller: Okay so yeah I want to make sure i'm understand what you're saying. so yes we do see it as a betrayal that it is. I mean are we basically gonna let manchin get away with this. Is that the answer?
Matt: Well who's we?
Caller: Like I think have aggressive when he is going to stop and yeah sorry.
Matt: But the thing is like we don't have anything that I can talk about Manchin's daughter being corrupt just and let's talk about all this stuff but all I can do is talk.
Caller: So let me rephrase when I say we actually mean biden.
Emma: yeah and letting Biden is 100 gonna let them get away with that.
Matt: And how would we let Biden get away?